Something Payment Ops Need to Know About ISO 20022 with Host Joe Casali
Wrestling Payments Podcast: Season 1 - Episode 10
Episode Summary
In this episode, Joe Casali from NEACH dives deep into the world of ISO 20022, the international standard for payments messaging. While ISO 20022 might be a fresh face in the US, its significance can't be understated. Drawing a unique parallel, Joe likens the fervor for ISO 20022 to that of a "mark" in wrestling - someone deeply passionate and invested in the industry's narratives. As the conversation unfolds, it's clear: Joe is all in on ISO 20022, seeing its potential to reshape the payments landscape.
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Guest-at-a-Glance
💡 Name: Joe Casali
💡 What he does: Host
💡Company: NEACH / Website
Key Insights
⚡ The Rise of ISO 20022 in Payment Systems
ISO 20022, an international standard for payments messaging, is gaining traction globally. While it's not entirely new, it's becoming more prominent in the US. Various organizations, from SWIFT to the Federal Reserve, are adopting ISO 20022 for their messaging systems. The Clearinghouse's RTP and the Federal Reserve's Fed Now both utilize versions of ISO 20022, showcasing its versatility and widespread acceptance.
⚡ The Debate Over "Rich Data"
There's a buzz around ISO 20022's ability to include "rich data" in its messages. However, Joe Casali challenges this notion. While ISO 20022 can carry additional data, the depth and richness of this data are up for debate. For instance, while it can include a URL or a 140-character message, questions arise about the security and practicality of such features.
⚡ ISO 20022 vs. EDI: A New Era of Messaging
Comparing ISO 20022 to Electronic Data Interchange (EDI), Joe highlights the evolution of computer-to-computer communication in payments. While EDI had its challenges, ISO 20022 offers a more streamlined approach. Companies can send payment messages directly to financial institutions, ensuring smoother transactions and reducing the need for manual interventions.
Episode Highlights
The Concept of a "Mark" in Wrestling and Payments
Timestamp: [00:01:34]
Joe Casali introduces the term "mark" from the world of professional wrestling. A "mark" is someone who is deeply passionate about wrestling and its narratives. Joe cleverly likens this term to those who are enthusiastic about ISO 20022, suggesting that he himself is a "mark" for this payment messaging system.
"Professional wrestling or at a carnival. This came out of a carnival back in the day because they would literally put a chalk mark on the customer's back to say he's the mark, he's our target. [...] I am a mark, I'm a mark for ISO 20022."
The Evolution of EDI and ISO 20022
Timestamp: [00:07:33]
Joe discusses the history and evolution of Electronic Data Interchange (EDI) and contrasts it with ISO 20022. He emphasizes the ideal of computer-to-computer communication, where transactions are seamless and require no manual intervention.
"My accounts payable go into your accounts receivable. My company knows I paid you. Your company knows you got paid. No one has to press a button. No one has to touch anything. No one has to rekey anything that's the ideal straight through the world."
The Challenge of "Rich Data" in ISO 20022
Timestamp: [00:11:58]
Joe challenges the popular notion that ISO 20022 can seamlessly incorporate "rich data" into its messages. He raises concerns about the depth and utility of such data, especially when it comes to security and practicality.
"The claim you hear when they're talking about ISO 20022 is that it includes rich data. [...] Maybe I'm overthinking this or not thinking this enough, but the rich data I'm having trouble with."
The Global Adoption of ISO 20022
Timestamp: [00:07:56]
Joe highlights the increasing global adoption of ISO 20022 in various payment systems. From SWIFT to the Federal Reserve, many organizations are embracing this international standard, indicating its growing importance in the payments landscape.
"RTP back in 2017, RTP said, we're gonna come up with an instant payment network, and we're gonna use as our messaging system a version of ISO 2 0 0 22. [...] SWIFT is a messaging system that says we need to pay someone in a foreign country. We have the network to communicate that message. There's no settlement involved, but they're now using ISO 20022 as their messaging system; they adopted it."
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